Re: [Sheflug] Very OT: Human nature, capitalism, socialism and Naomi Klein (was Re: RMS Talk)

[Alastair Donlon <nospam [at] netsoc.ucd.ie>]

On Fri, Nov 03, 2000 at 04:52:06PM +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> >>>>> "Timothy" == Timothy Baldwin <csyteb [at] comp.leeds.ac.uk> writes:
> 
>     Timothy> If personality was indeed tightly controlled by instinct
>     Timothy> then a stratergy of cooperating with people who
>     Timothy> cooperate, as has been demonstrated by various computer
>     Timothy> simulations.
> 
> Um, no.  What the computer simulations (starting with Robert Axelrod,
> _The Evolution of Cooperation_) demonstrated is that in the presence
> of extremely restricted information processing facilities, with a
> "greedy algorithm" (survival of the fittest) driving "evolution",
> non-cooperative "tit-for-tat" type strategies do very well (in species
> survival terms) in a broad range of environments (ie, distributions of
> "species" of strategy in the population).
> 
> These are _not_ cooperative strategies, or personalities, however.
> The (period by period) actions chosen are cooperative (in the sense
> that it is "win-win"), but the strategies themselves are extremely
> "capitalist" (more precisely, trade-oriented).  "Mutual
> backscratching", if you prefer.
> 
> Truly cooperative strategies die out very very quickly.
> 

It all depends on what you define by 'truly' cooperative. IMHO, 
no _single_ strategy can be called truly cooperative, because
cooperation is a function of a relationship between two (or more)
individuals. You could call 'tit-for-tat' cooperative, because
it allows that relationship to exist.

Axelrod's work only really showed that altruistic strategies
(where we _assume_ that we're never going to be cheated) do not
fare well in a diverse community. This does not simply translate
to 'capitilism' or 'socialism'.  In terms of cooperation the two
systems merely differ in where you can be cheated, and who you
watch for as a potential cheater. Capitilism tends to view
individuals as slightly suspicious, while socialism (or at least
the socialism that the SWP proposes) tends to view government
and corporations as the more dangerous.

A.D.

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